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[AKidsRight.Org] Meeting Senator Clinton - our political capital? / Your FEEDBACK.

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From: AKidsRight.Org Webmaster (
Date: Wed Aug 11 2004 - 16:27:57 EDT

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Good People & People of Faith,

This message contains info on:

1. Meeting Senator Clinton - what is our political capital?
2. Your FEEDBACK - When is someday Daddy?
3. Thanks - from PLYWOOD MAN, a free man!

1. Meeting Senator Clinton - what is our political capital?
Perhaps we should first explain, this is not a geography question.
The answer is not Washington, D.C.  We use the word 'capital' in the
same usage as talking about 'investment capital' (money). Capital is
what you have to make something happen.  We all know Senator Hillary
Rodham Clinton is a good person, a pretty big 'wheel', a very busy
person and a very good politician.  What does it take to get a meeting
with her?

We probably know at least two of the standard items:
* Have a LOT of money to contribute.
* Have a LOT of people organized around an issue.

Unfortunately we, as parents, don't have either of those right
now. Although we hope to in the future.  Please, don't be cynical, in
a Democracy its all about "getting elected and votes" -- both those
items help in that process.  Many of us feel that these also should be
important to her:

* We have some GREAT ideas about protecting Family rights!
* We have some GREAT ideas about (insert yours here)!
* A tragedy such as (insert yours here) should be prevented!

Can you imagine how long this list is when you look at all activism
for the environment, animals, the elderly, education, etc....  Many of
us forget the GREAT ideas of the past that stayed on that list for a
LONG time before being inacted (freedom from slavery, desegregation,
free speech, etc...).  How does a politican prioritize what is
important to the people -- what turns votes!  It is difficult to bring
change and the words of Henry David Thoreau still ring true:

The Role of NonViolent Action
Is to bring positive and sympathetic public attention.  The personal
sacrifice we make lets other people know we are serious about our
issue.  That our GREAT RIGHT to parent our children is so important,
we would be willing to sacrifice our very freedom to attain it.

In a small measure if you look at our list of NonViolent Action events
http://www.AKidsRight.Org/events.htm -- and follow the narratives.
There is some pretty amazing stuff there.

Right now we are outside the offices of Senator Clinton,

and are close to the threshold.  Almost everyone acknowledges that
with a few more people it would be VERY effective.  But it takes
time...there is a lot of risk.

It is hard to believe that Family Law reform is just NOT even a topic
in the American Presidential Campaign?  You just don't hear anything
about it.

One has to admire the effects of the Fathers-4-Justice.Org people in
England.  The public and peaceful actions of a few superheroes (who
risk jail) has made it a national issue there.

The funny thing ... when you hear some of the superhero interviews the
love they have for their children really comes through FIRST.  Only
people that LOVE are willing to make personal sacrifice.... at the
same time we have the murder/suicide bombers -- their hatred and
desire for revenge defines their actions...

What is our capital?  Our love for our children and our willingness to
sacrifice our freedom...  Loving parents are a political power that
any good politician cannot ignore.  Ms. Clinton is a good politician.
We don't have a meeting yet, because we are not ready.

2. Your FEEDBACK - When is someday Daddy?
We had some excellent feedback this week.  We welcome your comments
and try to give everyone that writes a reply (even if your message does
not appear here).  If you have further remarks on our reply you are
welcome to write back -- you do have the LAST word.

--- Cheryl Graves <>

> I believe that there has to be hope and I have faith that with hard
> work and a will to fight we can make a difference.....FOR KIDS
> We need to fight harder then we ever had to,and never give
> up!!!!!!!!!!!!

--- Dr. Richard Weiss <>

> . . . The corruption in the American [il]legal system defies
> credulity.  I don't feel that any peaceful civil protest or working
> within the present system will ever change the feminist drenched
> miscreants (judges, lawyers, legislators, bureaucrats, GALs, social
> workers, shrinks and state workers) who oppress fathers and thrive
> off the corrupt system.

I'm with you down to that last paragraph.  We have yet to see any
"peaceful civil protest" by parents of any scale in this country?
Isn't it a bit early to say it does not work?  I'm not sure that our
focus should be on the "miscreants" -- could you imagine if the focus
of Martin Luther King's efforts would have been on getting justice
from those "miscreant WHITE PEOPLE!"  (and which was later used in the
Black Power movement -- but not to good effect).

I get so frustrated when I hear "peaceful" does not work.  For most
people that means I wrote a lot of letters/email, and complained, and
called, and talked to people -- I would NOT expect that to work.
Where is the real sacrifice?  More and more I don't like hearing
"opressed fathers" -- it seems to be descent into victim hood!  If I
cry loud enough someone will pick me up? Yes, it happens more to men,
but hardly in an exclusive manner?

--- <>

> Reform will only happen..when men decide to stop writting letters
> and began to set forth an action team.  When a governor is forced
> down from do we force him's the demands of
> the people, Numbers gets results.

> Letters are good to get help from each other and advice...but when
> all effected fathers sit behind their computers and watches for
> others to do the will find those same fathers are doing
> the same thing....waitting and wishing to read about new
> laws.....those laws wont happen untill all fathers and groups come
> together as a whole and become a single power for the right
> cause.....our children.

Yes, you are quite right.  Letter and email may be good steps for
preparation, but they are not "action".  I'd also hope it becomes a
movement of parents to avoid the mom v. dad struggle and name calling.

--- Dr. Malcolm Hatfield <>

> I've been here done this with several don't take this
> personally and this is not a gender issue and certainly is not a
> political issue, because, we dads need to realize that we have not
> been "embraced" by the mainstream politicians.  We, you and I are at
> war, not with the Republicans or Democrats.....therefore, it is
> counterproductive for you and I to "play politics"....our cause is a
> basic human right.......I'm sure you will agree with me on
> that.......

> I've had several other dads try to "convert" me from being a card
> carrying Republican..........but just because I happen to support
> Bush, doesn't mean that I am not on "our" side when it comes to a
> dad's constitutional right to be a parent.....every time I write a
> check and support the Republican Party, I will swear on the Bible
> that I write on the memo portion of the check "I want to be a dad to
> my daughter"......  this is a strong statement that cannot ever be
> refruted.....this is why I believe the Republicans support "family
> rights" this ia a basic human right....forget about politics and the
> war....what is really more important?

> The answer is that no matter what our politics are, we must fight
> for the same basic human right......I am on your side...don't bring
> other issures into the mix.........I'm not here to discuss
> "crap?"......write your check....(if you can)....and make it clear
> to the whole wide world what matters most to you.......

> I have done this.....this is a basic human right...I am more
> committed to that than any other cause in my life....and don't you
> ever forget that...because that is my single sole purpose in
> gain equal rights for dads.....especially those dads who
> are falsely accused of sexually abusing their daughters.

--- Jeff Golden <>

>> When my son, Domenic (11), asked me that, "Daddy, when is someday?"
>> When can we be together, live a normal life in our home?  We were
>> driving down the road ...  I didn't have a brilliant answer (imagine
>> that -- at a loss for words!). All I said was, "I don't know when."

> Someone else, NOT YOU, who has experience with this, could give him
> a very different answer:
> When Domenic is willing to walk out of his mother's house and
> attempt, on his own, to get to your house (yes, I know its 2,000
> miles away), that will be "some day."  When Domenic is willing to
> say to the police, social workers, child protective agency, judges,
> psychs, juvenile detention facilities, etc., "I don't care what you
> say.  I want to be with my father.  I'll go back to my mother for
> now if you force me, but the first chance I get, I'm heading for my
> father's house again, and I won't stop trying until you let me go."
> THAT will be "some day."
> I know Domenic is only 11 now, but next year he will be 12, then 13.
> Instead of flying between your home and the ex's, you should be
> taking Greyhound busses.  Let Domenic see how busses and trains
> work, and how you can go anywhere in the country on them.
> A 16 year old taught me how kids can choose their own custody, if
> they have the "chutzpah" to do it.  I have "educated" dozens of
> children how to do it.  The youngest was a 12 year old girl.

Yes, the way things work now there is some truth in what you say.  Dom
does feel strongly and if I gave him the idea (and it has crossed my
mind) -- he would probably do something.  But I have not.

If I felt he was in real danger I would act and take him.  That is my
responsibility.  But that is not the case here.  Kids have no right to
'pick' their parents -- but they should have EQUAL parents involved in
their lives.  Especially with teenagers, turning custody into a
popularity contest can be a disaster.



Thanks for the message.  You may be right, but for now I will continue
and we'll see what happens.

--- MJ Lewis  <>
> Your newsletter inspired me to write the following...

 > When is someday Daddy?
 > When is someday Gamma?
 > When is someday Mommy?
 > Why can't I live with my REAL family ?
 > What do you answer when a child taken by the system
 > asks this question? 
 > How do you dry their tears from miles away? How do you
 > hold their hand when you can't touch them? 
 > How do you heal their hearts and minds when you can't
 > see or speak with them at all? 
 > How will anyone ever be able to really heal their
 > hearts and minds if we do not make better efforts to
 > find out what is systemically wrong with the 
 > "Family Assistance and Child Protective Services"
 > approach to families. ...

--- Anita Barnes <>

> Your plea sounds good, except one thing...freedom from child abuse
> allegation. As I victim of child abuse, legal system abuse, and
> having suffered in so many ways you can't know if you haven't
> experienced, I'd like to suggest ... you change that to allegations
> without evidence!
> Even with evidence of abuse, this society allows and ignores sexual
> abuse in all forms especially those crimes against children! I KNOW
> ... I"VE LIVED IT !! AS many of my friends have too!
> I realize that there is always 2 sides to every conflict and it
> takes 2 sides to accept responsibility and resolve conflict. !!
> Children victimized by child abuse, be it physical battery, mental
> battery, sexual, incest, etc. pay for the sins of others in many
> ways... often with their mind. And I believe a mind and a heart is
> truely a terrible thing to waste!
Thanks for the taking the time to write and sharing your experience.
It was not quite clear what happened to you, but I assume that you
were being abused by your parents and no one acted, or acted to late?

Yes, there needs to be evidence before the system acts.  But the
problem always is what is the evidence and is it convincing?  Who
decides?  I think long ago the standard was pretty high, you had to
win a criminal conviction against the accused (i.e. enough evidence
for a jury to reach a unanimous verdict of guilt).  But then people
felt that was "too much" to prove and too hard and now it seems to be
just a 'convincing allegation' that has some type of evidence. There
is no protection and a judge acting alone has the power to separate
parents/children for an entire childhood?

I would imagine that many times the 'evidence' was there for a
criminal conviction (maybe in your case), but the police/prosecutors
just didn't want to devote the effort to really investigate.  They
also have limited resources.... so we have compensated (many times) by
making it easier to separate kids/parents without the need for a lot
of process?

Perhaps the proper response is to put MORE emphasis on the police
investigation and evidence and give more resources to that.  But we
are not perfect and who can tell what goes on in a home?  At times we
just aren't going to able to act and terrible abuse goes on?

I'd like to close with one last question that you are in a good
position to answer.  It is often said of our present jury system that
it is better to let 9 guilty go free, than to convict one innocent
person.  I once spoke with a Congressional aid who told me that in the
cases of child abuse, it is better to separate 9 children from loving
parents, than to let one child live in a home with abuse?

How do you feel about that comparison? 

--- kevin merck <>

> ... First of all I would like to say that I am not a violent person. I
> have witnessed violence in my lifetime and find it the worst part of
> my human experience. A lot of us think we know what violence is, but
> in reality don't have a clue. Websters Dictionary defines violent
> like this: adj. marked by, due to, extreme force, passion or
> fierceness; of great force, intense - vi' o lence n.  Now when you
> tell me that you are going to jail for peacefully petitioning
> Hillary Clinton to try to peacefully deal with your situation, and
> the systems answer is to through you in jail, violence is being used
> against you. When I am told that I must pay child support for a
> child I wanted given up for adoption, to a female that I wasn't
> married to, for a child I didn't want, and if I don't they will
> through me in jail, violence is being used against me...

> You spoke of actions speaking louder than words, and I could not
> agree more,but I think the type of action speaks volumes. You will
> have a taste of what's in it for you, by the action you chose to
> take, and I hope you live through it unscathed. I have struggled
> with the question myself now for years. What can I do? Now this is
> where I need you to keep as open a mind as possible. The single
> thing that I can do without the cooperation of the millions of
> people we will need to " bring reform closer " is to stop
> cooperating with the system that is oppressing me. 

> Now, what that means in your case, I have no idea. For me it means
> to stop paying the child support. I have been afraid to do it in the
> past because of the terrorist tactics being used against me. I
> wanted to know, that if I was willing to take that risk, everyone
> would have to take the stand. Well unfortunately, things don't work
> like that. I must take action, and do my best to convince others to
> do the same, and have faith that the truth and Gods guidance will
> see me through. We are all superheroes when the truth is on our
> side, and when the truth is on your side, so is God.

Sorry, but I think you are quite wrong here. You are "hiding", not
forcing things to a point, but just escaping.  Eventually they will
probably find you and throw you in jail as a coward.  That is hardly
"making a stand."  BUT PLEASE understand, I've spent 6 months in jail
already when dragged in on support.

The violence the system can apply to you is awesome and it is natural
(and understandable) to just want to run.  We are only flesh & blood
and our faith and confidence is weak.  No one can blame you for
wanting to just get away and have a chance for a normal life -- but
don't make it an admirable act.

If you were going to make a 'stand' do it very publicly.  But I'm
honestly not sure what your 'stand' is?  What is the moral positive
you are promoting?  Sounds like you had sex with someone, they had
your child (without informing you), and you want no part of your own
progeny and just want to forget the whole thing?  Sort of like
post-natal abortion?  Many people thing we should have a 'rewind'
button when a child is conceived, but not wanted?

However, perhaps your stand could be. Present societal norms allow the
other parent to unilaterally abort my child and even give them up
right after birth -- and be free of obligations.  Why can't I have
those same choices?  There is some logic to that argument -- if one
accepts the premise of abortion/abandonement...

> Think about for a while John. Stop cooperating with the forces of
> evil working against you. Stand up to them, and others will learn by
> your example. The single one thing that each of us can do right now,
> right this minute, is to stop cooperating. They rely on our
> cooperation, without it they are a paper tiger. Take care, and best
> wishes to you and your son.

Like I said above, we need much more than noncooperation, but
positive action.  Obviously, read history and social movements --
give me an example of your approach.  Then we can all learn.

>>>>> follow up reply from Kevin

>  Well, I can't say I didn't know better, but I thought I would try
>  anyway. John, I get the distinct impression that you are a deeply
>  hostile person. Is that why your wife moved so far away? Was there
>  spousal abuse? I can't think of a bigger coward than one who would
>  physically abuse his wife. If that was the case, why don't you get
>  some help. Was there alleged abuse of your son as well. I think you
>  alluded to that in your email " What can we do to bring reform
>  closer." Is that why they moved so far away. Any coward who would
>  abuse his wife would probably do something to his own kid too.

--- "Barbara Goodchild" <>

> Suit Up! is a Christian site based on the armor of God, equiping,
> preparing, and making aware the body of Christ. I have also become
> involved in non-custodial parenting rights and am the Coordinator
> for the state of Delaware in the class action suit initiated by Torm
> Howse and the Indiana Civil Rights Council.  Looking to get the
> message out, knowing that our Father is the Father of the
> fatherless, even those made fatherless though biased courts.</P>


3. Thanks - from PLYWOOD MAN!

--- mark bogan <>

> PLYWOOD MAN has been aquitted, under section 579 of the Canadian
> Criminal Code.  Will attend Rally, despite the outcomes.  Special
> thanks to this org. for the posting.

> PLYWOOD MAN remains in his secret finished basement planning his
> next strike.  He continues to hope he is not alone.  In solidarity,
> P M

webmaster@AKidsRight.Org             "A Kid's Right to BOTH parents" 
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