Passport renewal challenge/ Ron Paul/ Obstacles & YOUR FEEDBACK

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From: John Murtari (
Date: Fri Nov 30 2007 - 10:28:19 EST

Good People & People of Faith,

1. Passport renewal - Ready for Federal Case?
2. Ron Paul - His position on Family Law reform?
3. Debra Root - FEEDBACK on obstacles to progress.
4. Your FEEDBACK - on being weary of reform.

1. Passport renewal - Ready for Federal Case?
I (John Murtari) have a lot of Aunts, Uncles, & Cousins in Italy that
I used to visit in the past (all from my Mom's side of the family).
We even went there in 2000 with my son Dom.  Because of 'support
arrears' I'm unable to renew my Passport and I find that very annoying
and a restriction on my liberty to travel.  One of my Aunt's (my Mom's
next youngest sister) is 88, and both Dom and I would like to see her
before she is 'gone'.  There is too much 'irony' in a 'support' mess
stopping me from fulfilling other obligations related to immediate
family!  I'm sure there are some of you in similar situations --
pretty soon you won't even be able to travel to Canada!

Support has never been my main issue for reform.  I feel it's a
distraction from our main focus on Family Rights, but.....  I'm
getting real close to filing a Federal Civil action in our local
District Court regarding this.  The basic argument is 'suspension' of
Passport renewal is an unconstitutional limit of our liberty to travel
-- especially when arising out of a civil matter with very limited
'due process' protections (we all know how arbitrary support
proceedings can be). 

I was getting ready to start work on something when I saw the Federal
filing fee is $350 -- that slowed me down!  Some questions:

* Has any such action been brought in Federal Court before? What

* Do any of you have references to any case law for/against?

* Would any of you be willing to contribute for the filing fee if
  I can get this thing ready.  You can see it, make inputs, before 
  I file it.

* Is there a lawyer in Fed. Practice willing to work on this?  You
  would think it would make a beautiful 'class action' suit.

I do think Syracuse, the Northern District of New York, may be a good
venue.  I have 'met' all the Magistrates (that would initially handle
it) and I do feel they respect my manners and know I'm sincere in my
actions -- we might have a sympathetic ear, including the local media.

I'm still planning on returning to the Syracuse Federal Building in
early January.  I have a Dad to join me, but still looking for a Mom?

2. Ron Paul - His position on Family Law reform?
Like me, many of you may have seen messages about the candidacy of
Mr. Ron Paul for President. Some people feel he is our champion for
family law reform.  I went to his web site at: and didn't see anything addressing the
topic of family law?  I'd like to share some info with folks on the
list.  If you have any web links to direct quotes from Mr. Paul please
let me know and we'll use them in an upcoming message.

If there is another candidate you feel has taken some good positions
on reform, please pass links to that info also ... again, we are
looking for direct quotes.

3. Debra Root - obstacles to progress.
[ Debra is an NCP and in a couple of messages below I really think she
hits upon the 'what's wrong with us' as a movement for reform.]

--- Debra Root <>

> For several days I have been wrestling with with the question you
> posed at the end of your email (Why don't we have the courage to
> sacrifice for what we believe in?)

> How? More importantly, will it matter?

> Indeed, much progress in the area of civil rights for black
> Americans has taken place over the past few decades.  Similarly, who
> would have dreamed that Mandela would eventually become President in
> South Africa?

> This is hopeful, but there is still much more work to be done.  But
> what about us-the dissatisfied non-custodial parent?

> We have many obstacles to overcome....

>    1. We are geographically separated

>    2. Unlike being a member of a minority, our status is somewhat
>    temporary. Change may come when our child(ren) become adults

>    3. We are not understood by the Majority who still adhere to
>    stereotypes (deadbeats, etc)

>    4. Some activists "on our side" are blatantly misogynistic.

> And so on....

I agree a LOT with what you say are the obstacles. I see the same
things and it is pretty depressing at times!  But we have Faith, and
we try -- I guess that is all we can do.  If we worry about 'results'
-- we get frozen.  I have a great quote from Gandhi:

    "He who is brooding over result often loses nerve in the
    performance of duty. He becomes impatient and then gives vent to
    anger . . . he jumps from action to action, never remaining
    faithful to any. He who broods over results . . . is every
    distracted, he says good-bye to all scruples, everything is right
    in his estimation and he therefore resorts to means fair & foul to
    attain his end. Not focusing on "results" gives one the inner
    peace to achieve final goals, this is renunciation."

Does that describe a lot of people in this movement or what?!

> ...  The legal world is one of winners and losers.  It is a world
> that pivots on privilege and money.  Who cares about a few people
> that can't see their children yet still have to support them
> financially?  Surely, they (the non-custodial parent) must have done
> something wrong!

> Non-custodial fathers complaining about paying child support?
> Deadbeats that don't want to support their offspring.  Non-custodial
> mothers?  Drug-addicted nut cases not fit to raise children.

> I challenge ANYONE to give me a reason to believe that anything will
> ever change.  For me, I am comforted by those who understand my
> pain. My son and I wait for the day that we will see each other
> again.  He will be 18 years old in 4 years.

... I'll share one thought from a speech a Black Judge gave at the DC
Rally.  He lived through segregation, he told us -- their opponents
used to say, "Segregation yesterday, today, and forever!" -- they were

I know you have been on the list for a long time, you ask 'I challenge
ANYONE to give me a reason to believe...', just look at history, what
happened to segregation, what sacrifice can accomplish.

Perhaps you/we should ask, "Why don't I have the courage to sacrifice
for what I believe in?"

4. Your FEEDBACK - on being weary of reform.
This message resonated with a LOT of people.  We had a flood of
FEEDBACK!  See the original message:

--- Edna <>

> "Believe only..."  "Do not grow weary in well doing, for in due time
> ye shall reap if ye faint not".

--- Matt <>

> Your wrong ... both men are dead....  It has become a waste of time,
> and I have moved forward....

> Don't get me wrong... I hurt for my children EVERY DAY!  But in my
> heart...  I know they will come home someday ... and what goes
> around. Comes around..... And that is what I have to believe to get
> threw my days.....  I continue to raise my other children, who are
> growing into wonderful adults ... and who will have the burden of
> explaining the results of the selfish women how took the children
> from our lives...

You may be correct in how you feel.  Time will tell.  Glad to hear you
have contact with your other kids!

--- "Stephen Baskerville" <>

> Captures it perfectly: weary but faithful.  Thanks for writing this.

--- Paul <>

> Had you read Stephen Baskerville's book, "Taken into Custody?"  In
> my view it's a magnificent piece of work...

--- rc woody <>

> Wise words John.  I know that over the past seven years I've had my
> fill of getting kicked and forcing myself to get back up, only to
> get kicked in the teeth again.  I always reminded myself that
> someone, somewhere is going through this torture too, and there is
> always someone who has it worse than you, and God has a reason for
> this happening.


> Jesus spent alot of time telling about how evil and hypocritical the
> Sadducee's and pharisees were and even went into the temple and
> flipped over their tables.  For those who are Christian, I believe
> it would Christ like to do the same, when we know for sure the evil
> hypocritical things that they are doing to us.

You may be right, but I prefer the story of the Pharisee and the tax
collector praying in the temple.  I think we would be better worried
about our own failures of faith and love, and asking for mercy -- than
going after others?

--- "kriz" <>

>  .... God will have nothing to do with eliminating the corrupt
>  officials in government.

... but if we are 'believers' shouldn't we have Faith in 1) God's help
as we work for justice.  2) Realizing those corrupt officials are also
our brothers and sisters?

--- "Annie Marie" <>

> What a wonderful and inspirational email.  Perhaps those of us that suffer
> from the system become the best at
> Inspiring on behalf of God.  It gives me great faith to see the strength...
> Powerful...powerful...powerful..

--- Howard Wizenberg <>

> Nice letter. I got myself weary when i was sanctioned for some
> nonsense on the father's list. I used the word Pissed off in
> father's for justice... and removed myself because of the complaints
> of using those words. there is too much BS for me. I now stay quiet
> and watch. I am a lucky one, I have my sons.... But I will NEVER
> forget.

... The lists can be very strange, it really turns into just a flood
of talk without no-one actually doing anything?  I think one bad part
of 'lists' is that you have people spouting opinions from their
'couch', but who never actually attend a real meeting or get involved?

--- Jeffrey Tennis <>

> I'm a Christian, my pastor is a Christian and one of my students is
> a Christian, yet we all face the same battle... a battle to preserve
> a relationship with our children against a godless family law
> system.  Your stories and the pics you share -- you and your son --
> are empowering to the rest of us.  "...Restoring the hearts of the
> fathers to their children" may very well have an alternate meaning.

--- Ray Blumhorst <>

> Thanks John, I really appreciated that email.  I always wear my
> three Vietnam medals on my ball cap when protesting, and I have a
> commemorative cold war medal I wear too. I just got that certificate
> a few months back signed by Secretary of Defense, Donald Rumsfield.
> IMO, we FRA's and MRA's are presently front line cold war
> "soldiers," on point against the infrastructure of gender feminist,
> women's studies programs, gender feminist, women's commissions,
> gender feminists lawmakers and other, cultural Marxist, gender
> feminist, women's industry programs arrayed against us through
> family courts - and other places.

> In the service, we took an oath to defend our country from all
> enemies foreign and domestic.  Did either of us think we could/would
> seriously disregard that oath when we returned to civilian life?
> Family courts in America today are very real domestic enemies of
> America working to destroy all semblance of traditional family life,
> and it follows the cultural Marxist belief about an oppressive
> Patriarchy at its core.  Faith in God is a comfort as we are
> wearied, but not beaten by the oppressive abuses that are hurled at
> us by a legal system gone unAmerican towards those it is sworn to
> serve.

> If not us, then who?  Who better than us to confront this domestic
> enemies of America?

> God Bless You.  Hang in there bro.  Nobody knows better than you,
> when it's time to rest and when it's time to stand your ground.

Yes, I would expect parents who have worn the uniform to better
understand the need for sacrifice if the rights of parents (both mom
and dad) to be protected from gov't interference.  But, I don't feel
that women are our 'enemy', no more than I would have felt that
white's were the 'enemy' of blacks during segregation.  It is a
foolish system and we just need to open people's eyes to how bad it

--- Karen Armbruster <>

> As I read your email I felt pressed upon by the Lord to encourage
> you and send you to the word of God.  Of course I had the perfect
> verse but He sent me to Romans 8:18-39.  I know it is hard but we
> have to do all things unto Him...My heart has been so weary for this
> cause as well, but you have encouraged me through your undying
> efforts.  I can't tell you how I have cried for my husband's
> daughter and even now am fighting back the tears, but the Lord is
> good.  Your son will always know that you fought and fought hard for
> him and so many others.  What you are sowing in him you will reap.
> I have seen this start to show with my step-daughter.  God is
> faithful and he will give you beauty for your ashes.  Don't stop
> fighting.  He is always with you and will never leave you...

--- "Dr. Asif Suleman" <>

> I have not written in a long time to you I understand fully about
> the "burn out" It ain't easy doing so much for so many And still
> facing criticism and having to sometimes justify Your actions and
> words...I too often disagree with your Methods and thinking, but I
> also draw great inspiration from Your F4J -KZN ,
> south Africa, the work Is often never ending and often feels like a
> one man show...  Tired and weary with the struggle we grow.....only
> To find that in a weeks time the burning passion for justice and
> Family law reform cant be put out Its an addiction and a
> commitment....  The next case comes along and the flame rekindles
> brighter than ever

> We do this not for ourselves I.e. Adults but for our children And to
> leave behind a legacy, far better for our children than The world we
> entered into HANG IN THERE COMRADE


--- Frank Votra <>

> Weary? Yes!  However, that is the point of the other side and the
> courts for that matter. To make men weary so you will give up.  I am
> convinced the courts hate men as there no Federal money in
> protecting and representing them as there are for women. So they can
> run men through the judicial and legal wringer and make them pay or
> garner federal funding.  When men fall behind in support after
> taking on the burden of paying for protection in court that is even
> better as the arrest will be a warning to other men that the iron
> fist of civil law will come down on you and your legal rights as an
> American citizen will be thrown away.  Indeed, I would say that
> illegal aliens have more standing in a court of law than a father
> falsely accused of abuse or some other slanderous remark used to
> gain court room advantage. Let me clarify that point further. 

> I was issued a domestic violence injunction for calling the women in
> question stupid.  It was a point of fact. It was not slander. I have
> been in court for 12 years something I didn't want to do fighting
> for my rights and that of access to my son and the one thing that I
> have learned is that the civil courts and the liberal judges that
> occupy the bench are both blind and corrupt and who only have one
> goal in mind.  Obtain money.  Be it through sucking from the trough
> of federal programs or imposing a deplorable financial burden on
> men.  Most men go belly up and quit.  The problem is we need more
> men to fight and show what the corrupt courts are doing to the
> nation.

They do try to beat you down.  But I hope we can consider ourself
mothers & fathers fighting for our Civil Right to be Fit & Equal
parents to our children.  We do need more parents to get involved,
actions do speak louder than just words.

--- Jerry Bernard <>

> I am Jerry Bernard, President of ECMAS (Equitable Child Maintenance
> and Access Society) in Edmonton, Alberta, Canada.  I've been
> following your journey since you went on the IV. thing in the
> summer.  I think you're at a moment in time where most alienated
> parents reach, and give up.  I hate to use the term "give up",
> because we never really do, it's tyhe system or people whom have
> foisted you emotionally to a point where you can't keep up the same
> level of energy required to keep fighting and/or pursuing what's in
> the best interest of the children.  I am pretty close to that
> myself.  I have, hopefully, one more court hearing on Nov 21st.
> It's simply to give back, to my two teenagers, the right to be
> involved with their father.  Should they choose not to, then they
> won't use the opportunity.  I think it is their loss but not their
> fault, nor my fault for trying to give them that right.
> What you have done is very important and whether you realize it or
> not, you've given a lot of people courage and the will to battle on.
> I, on the other hand, have done the same in a different way.  I will
> try to continue with our monthly board meetings (as President) and
> continue with our weekly support group meetings and try to make a
> difference where I can.  Currently we have an author (Robert Kennedy)
> whom is visiting out of Toronto to do research for a book on our
> common causes.  I have set him up with 15- 20 interviews for his
> research and hopefully his publication (He is a professor at the
> University of York) sponsored by York U., will make a difference.
> If it does, I'm sure it is only one of the beginnings.  The more
> efforts which groups like ours and your efforts do, the better it
> will be for our children and grandchildren.  I don't expect top see
> a lot of results firsthand but hopefully our descendants won't have
> to go through the same emotional drainings and state of affairs
> which we have to.  In time, I believe the right thing to do will
> prevail.  Thanks for your efforts and I know that you haven't or
> ever will give up.  When they come calling, you'll be there for
> them.  God Bless.

--- Ron <>

> I too wearied of the legal (for lack of better description that can
> be put in print) system, and resigned myself to the point where, if
> my kids ever wake up from the mind poisoning, I'll be there for
> them. You can only deal with issues you have control of.

> As I have said before, you are wasting your time and now the court's
> time in trying to see Clinton. Her agenda has nothing to do with
> what's best for the country, only what's best for her ego. It's a
> sad time, when egos run the government as well as a major portion of
> American Corporations.

> Spend your energy on keeping ones like Clinton out of
> office. Contact the Republican National Committee and see if they
> would have an interest in your plight. If nothing else, it could be
> a way of getting something started as far as reform goes, as the
> politicians position themselves to make good appearances as election
> time nears. It tried to contact them on your behalf, obviously not
> mentioning your name, but have not been able to get past the "make a
> contribution" part of the web site. All the parties are so fixated
> on raising contributions, they are losing site or their purpose.

I think I have said this a lot before, but if Clinton is anything, she
is a very good politician and is influenced by public opinion -- Civil
Rights are usually supported by everyone (once they are recognized) --
to the extent we as parents are ignored, is more of a comment on our
lack of focus on a clear goal and commitment to our beliefs -- than
it is about her or any politician.

--- Jim Pleace <>

> I am clearly weary-I found a picture of my kids right before the
> divorce-Jake was 4 and Ben was 5. Sad-all those years where I didn't
> get to wake up to them at my bedside. I must say struggling to
> define and enjoy what is "time" with them and where does all this
> end is a mental task not easily put into a box-it is an existential
> crisis to be sure. I can say that I really enjoyed my Children this
> weekend on my "non-custodial furlough". Perhaps that's what we
> should call it if we want a definition. That's what if feels like, a
> temporary, repetitive and minute reprieve from being the male in the
> conception of the children. Thank you, tender years doctrine. Does
> it feel like a combat campaign? Yes-although I've never actually been
> to combat I have served in a Marine Infantry Unit and I can say that
> this is the closet that I have felt in a prolonged way that I used
> to feel after long patrols in miserable conditions.  I have real
> empathy for these kids coming home from Iraq and

> I want a better America for their children and mine. My kids are
> aware of what's going on. Do I quit? No. Am I still leading the
> unit? No, but as I believe Greg from NY said, even if I can't lead
> right now and we seem dead in the water, I can still be one of the
> silent masses in wait. I am participating in choosing a better
> President if I can't change State Law. Most of all, my kids know
> that I am THEIR dad and no other. John, my thoughts are with you
> this "holiday" season (I hate that euphemism).

--- Douglas Richardson <>

> You do not stand alone my friend I feel your pain; warriors-true
> warriors often contemplate and second-guess themselves in light of
> really understanding the task they set out to achieve.

> Many days I am very lonely and confused and ponder on the thought I
> am a foolish individual, nobody cares and this will never change. I
> have gone against the grain of this very fight despite losing
> friends and family in belief I have absolutely lost my mind. I often
> reflect to words a very close friend stated to me when I entered
> into this ring, He said Doug be very careful, make sure in the end
> it is not you at your computer alone, and many days is it just that.

> Over the last two years, I have made a spectacle out of my self in
> open public and closed-door meetings.  When I think of the courts,
> the paper trail I have compiled my stomach starts to turn, and I
> actually become nausea. I am often disgusted with my self for
> letting this live my life, instead of me living my life. My father
> was a tough skinned individual who would not accept no for an
> answer, he has left some very large shoes to fill.

> I have convinced myself a few times over the course of the last few
> years, ITS OVER I am moving on with my life and not looking back, I
> can not bear another day of living like this, feeling so used and
> useless. When I did pause for short briefs of time I have
> discovered, or am at least under the belief it is gods way of saying
> take a break and ponder on what you have invisibly achieved. You
> have gained friends you would have never known, you have come to
> really understand yourself and what has happened to you by actions
> of others. You have created awareness only you could do by sharing
> your life with complete strangers. While I may not have
> simultaneously changed the wrongs that are being done in the
> family¿½ courts, I have certainly shown reason for change. I may
> not be alive to witness the day of reckoning but my words and
> actions will last forever.

> I hope and pray, that our children will be free to live there lives
> and enjoy the freedoms America has to offer, because of that hope, I
> will take this too my grave. The individuals that engage in this
> type of fight are constantly put under extreme scrutiny and endure
> more resistance then the average person could ever fathom. It really
> does take special bread, both on a physical and emotional level to
> continue in this fight, John you are one of those special
> individuals that is willing to stand for the ones who can not stand
> for themselves, just as our fallen soldiers. Do not waste that god
> given gift, you are being heard from afar.

--- Debra Root <>

> You are certainly the "shining light" for those of us who suffer the
> indignity of being shut out of our child(ren's) lives.  Yes, we are
> weary.  Some of us have given up-we do not expect any change in our
> particular situations nor reform in our lifetime.

> I respect your faith. Moreover, I respect the fact you do not expect
> everyone to embrace it.

> Divorce, child custody, whatever, is a relatively new phenomenon.
> The jury is still out; the history has not been written yet. It
> is-in many ways-treated like leprosy.  In other words, it is all
> pervasive but usually someone else's problem.

> In my opinion, nothing short of a revolution will change the
> unspeakable situation of many non-custodial parents.  The legal
> world is one of winners and losers.  It is a world that pivots on
> privilege and money.  Who cares about a few people that can't see
> their children yet still have to support them financially?  Surely,
> they (the non-custodial parent) must have done something wrong!

> Non-custodial fathers complaining about paying child support?
> Deadbeats that don't want to support their offspring.  Non-custodial
> mothers?  Drug-addicted nut cases not fit to raise children.

> I challenge ANYONE to give me a reason to believe that anything will
> ever change.  For me, I am comforted by those who understand my
> pain. My son and I wait for the day that we will see each other
> again.  He will be 18 years old in 4 years.

... I'll share one thought from a speech a Black Judge gave at the DC
Rally.  He lived through segregation, he told us -- their opponents
used to say, "Segregation yesterday, today, and forever!" -- they were

I know you have been on the list for a long time, you ask 'I challenge
ANYONE to give me a reason to believe...', just look at history, what
happened to segregation, what sacrifice can accomplish.

Perhaps you/we should ask, "Why don't I have the courage to sacrifice
for what I believe in?"

--- Theresa Ivey <>

> I appreciate everything you have done in your efforts for your child
> and countless others.

> So many scriptures came to mind as I read your post. Here are a few
> of them. I hope the Lord uses them to refresh and strengthen you.

> Ephesians 6:12 For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but
> against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the
> darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.

> Galatians 6:9 And let us not be weary in well doing: for in due
> season we shall reap, if we faint not.  KJV

> John 16: 33 These things I have spoken unto you, that in me ye might
> have peace. In the world ye shall have tribulation: but be of good
> cheer; I have overcome the world.  KJV

> Romans 8:18 For I reckon that the sufferings of this present time
> are not worthy to be compared with the glory which shall be revealed
> in us.  KJV

> Revelation 21:4 And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes;
> and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying,
> neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are
> passed away.  KJV

                                       John Murtari
Coordinator                            AKidsRight.Org
jmurtari@AKidsRight.Org                "A Kid's Right to BOTH parents"
Toll Free (877) 635-1968(x-211)        http://www.AKidsRight.Org/

A Kid's Right to Both Parents!
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